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 Post subject: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 8:28 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:29 am
Posts: 230
I'd like to start by giving the Wellingtons and their escorts a big S. I appreciate the effort you gave knowing that you were isolated and flying into enemy dar coverage far from any help that could be sent. After knocking down F99 to within ONE target, you accomplished anything that could be asked of you.

Nightstalkers....wow, you guys rock! Although I didn't think the strikes would be opposed, you guys took down both radar stations, knocking at least 10 miles of enemy dar coverage in the NW of Sicily that can be exploited later in the series. Then, the icing on the cake was taking out the final target at F99 while the Axis was distracted to the SE, closing it and leaving a hole in Mid-Sicily. A big WTG to -gums- to help co-ordinate that strike and when he returns from being POW, he is gonna get a chest full of salad :mrgreen:

The Axis did pretty much what I anticipated in this frame. They had airfield within 5 miles of some of these beachheads and shuttled back and forth strafing and bombing those easy targets that there was no way to defend without commiting to an 100 mile front to CAP, not including the convoys IB to the beachheads.

I was keenly aware the limitations of the airframes that we were given, hence my desire to keep the fights to the south of Sicily. The LW time and time again showed an unwilingness to fly out of their dar coverage (with the exception of a lone scout) and even turned back in hot pursuit several times. After many proddings from frustrated pilots looking for a fight, I directed an engagement on enemy dar...which is what they wanted. I know you guys gave it everything you could and I appreciate that. Even thou I think we came out on the short end, you may be assured that the Axis was totally focused on this engagement and this allowed a opening shot to the Stalkers, who took that field down.

I would also like to extend my appreciation for all you who realized that I was watching 80 miles of axis activity over the beachheads, the Wellington strike farther west and peeking at the NS targets to the far west as well. You guys were very patient and tried to give me all the support you could...thanks <S>. I know that frustration can build quickly, it's boring flying holes in the sky with no action. We just got frustrated before the Axis did, because I'm still convinced that the engagement that you guys fought could have been farther south. I'm glad I have a pretty thick skin after reading some of the comments made in the buffer. I would have preferred to be up flying with the rest of my squad, but we were required by rule to provide a CO for a frame this series. No one wanted this hot potato of a frame so I did it myself.

Speaking of rules, I would like to highlight 2 things this frame...

1) Fw 190s hunting the convoy were allowed to pursue and engage the Allied strike package of Wellingtons and escorts. While there isn't a rule specifically against this, to me this is violation of the intention/spirit of this series. Now the 190 must be accounted for in any air-air engagement which gives the axis that many more fighters, seeing as the Knights only have 1 frame they have to fly the JU88.

2) Upon learning that an axis fighter was forced down to ditch, I witnessed his not exiting the aircraft until the very end of the frame...most likely intending on denying a kill (that the allied pilot DID get by waiting in tower WTG!)
Quote:
Ditching - in the S3 once you have to ditch exit your plane quickly, do not try and linger to avoid the kill to a deserving player on the otherside. A player that does this will have the ditched location reported to nearby enemy planes.

In my opinion, this is a blatant violation of the rules and should be penalized.

In closing, my thanks again for the effort you all put out and appreciation for those who tried to help out. This was an extremely difficult frame the way it was setup and in getting 30+ points from strikes, we cut the Axis lead significantly with the ease they could have accumulated points in this frame.

<S>


Sasquatch"
=sqtc=
23rd Fighter Group
CO


"You know you loaded too much fuel only when you see fire" :P


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 11:54 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:28 pm
Posts: 106
Sasquatch wrote:
This was an extremely difficult frame the way it was setup and in getting 30+ points from strikes, we cut the Axis lead significantly with the ease they could have accumulated points in this frame.

<S>



My rough count is:

1 GAF 9 pts
2 Radar Stations 16 pts
11 static ships 22 pts

Total should be at least 47 from strike assests.

<S>


Colonel mt-dew
Commanding Officer
-=Night Stalkers=-
"If you see us, it's already too late"


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 1:45 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 13, 2014 9:25 pm
Posts: 661
Sasquatch wrote:
Speaking of rules, I would like to highlight 2 things this frame...

1) Fw 190s hunting the convoy were allowed to pursue and engage the Allied strike package of Wellingtons and escorts. While there isn't a rule specifically against this, to me this is violation of the intention/spirit of this series. Now the 190 must be accounted for in any air-air engagement which gives the axis that many more fighters, seeing as the Knights only have 1 frame they have to fly the JU88.

2) Upon learning that an axis fighter was forced down to ditch, I witnessed his not exiting the aircraft until the very end of the frame...most likely intending on denying a kill (that the allied pilot DID get by waiting in tower WTG!)
Quote:
Ditching - in the S3 once you have to ditch exit your plane quickly, do not try and linger to avoid the kill to a deserving player on the otherside. A player that does this will have the ditched location reported to nearby enemy planes.

In my opinion, this is a blatant violation of the rules and should be penalized.

In closing, my thanks again for the effort you all put out and appreciation for those who tried to help out. This was an extremely difficult frame the way it was setup and in getting 30+ points from strikes, we cut the Axis lead significantly with the ease they could have accumulated points in this frame.

<S>


I witnessed the same waiting in the ditched aircraft on my kill of Vulche (3 other guys strafed him as he sat) and I suspect at least one of the other aircraft I damaged heavily did the same thing since it was late frame.


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2013 9:34 pm
Posts: 1899
Location: Toronto, ON
Nice going Dew and NS. And of course the Nomads and UMM :)


CO Beaver
RCAF 417 (II/Wing 127)
City of Windsor


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 571
Location: Northern Minnesota
One concern I have, and Jabo would have to chime in, After I belly flopped I was checking out some of the beachhead fields and noticed the nearby Arty Fields where shooting at the landing craft and fields. I believe thats where a lot of the early kills in the buffer came from. Do those count as AX points?


<S!>
MuskyZ
Newest member of the 4th

No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country.
George S. Patton


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 3:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 14, 2013 7:09 pm
Posts: 620
<S> Sasquatch and the Allies. I had command of the 4th FG last night as =weis= (4th CO) could not attend.
Everyone did great with what we had, as this was supposed to be our hardest frame. Also a big <S> to the NS, and to the 475th who saved our 4th buttocks late frame.

The player refusing to leave his plane was dolch-, and he was oiled by jedijc. He got oiled several minutes prior to T+160 at the deck. He did not leave his plane until 15-20 minutes after. There is no freaking way you can keep airborne in an oiled plane for 15+ minutes when your starting altitude is 500 ft.

I tried to get in contact with -jabo- several times to force a flight-exit, but it seemed he was AFK. Jedijc had to stay in tower for 20 minutes even though he needed to logg off. Had he not stayed in twr then dolch- would most probably have gotten away with his blatant violation of the rules.

-jabo- sir, any ruling on this?

/Robert
acting XO 4th FG


Last edited by Robert on Tue May 19, 2015 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 5:36 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2013 3:00 pm
Posts: 672
Location: Florida
Salute!

Decent frame, IMHO.

I did not wish to be a "pill" or irritant, but after at least two UMM/Nomad plots did not know what tgt was still up at F99 and could have hit it, I thot it was worth a shot by a brave lite or a Stalker. The buffs were all shot down and my ACMCAM of the AE/100th/UMM/Nomad furball with Fokkers and Messerschidts is a hoot. I could see the Axis swine BZ down on the beach landings and figured it was worth a shot.

All is well that ends well, ya think?

One Nomad was TDY, but a new Nomad took his place, and an oldtime buffer: Thud--

The AE and 100th did as well as they could, but the furball over F99 was just too much.

Gums sends...


"God in your guts, good men at your back, wings that stay on - and Tally Ho!"


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 Post subject: Re: TSU Frame II CO AAR
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:47 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:42 pm
Posts: 392
I was very curious to see what happened this frame. Sometimes its funny to think what the other sides thinks you think. Sometimes its enlightening to learn from. We've been waiting the whole series for you guys to do what you did the last two frames.

At first we thought you guys were going to bum rush us up the middle. Our objective was to grab what points you would allow us and then do what we can on defense. You came, then faded off Dar, came, and faded again. Immediately snuffed it out as a trap and searched to the west for the buffs. If you flew closer it might have worked. We are aggressive and want to fight, but we are not stupid. We prepared for a 2v1 fight the whole series which never came until the end. We knew sneak attacks would happen all over, but also knew there was little to do about it with our numbers. So we just went to town killing things hoping it would goad you into a fight. Crossed our fingers sending 1 fighter group to what were clearly the buffs but were surprised to find them pretty much naked. Even during that engagement we were looking to be bounced.

Everyone thinks our plane matchups are bad, even on our end. But we practice with what we have and never ever let the enemy play to our weaknesses, as much as can be helped. Instead of worrying about what we can't do for whatever reason we focus on what we can.


<S>
Zinhwk

HADES Flight
475th FG (v)
zinhwk@fly-jg77.com


Windows 10.1
AMD A10 6800K Black Edition (OC 4.2Ghz)
16 GB DDR3
GeForce GTX 770Ti
1TB SATA Western Digital "Blue" HDD
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