S3 Series

Strange indeed, seems like a 500lb GP is enough to kill an "ack" almost 3 times over.
Either I was wildly inaccurate with my dive bombing or they didn't do much.

Sun Nov 24 21:48:42 2013 LAUNCH +bolok MosquitoVI ORD7 C1 F32

1st 500lb GP bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:02:28 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F021G3002 500lb GP Bomb (40mm ACK right next to radars)
Sun Nov 24 22:02:28 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F021RD002 500lb GP Bomb (Dish radar)

2nd 500lb GP bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:02:28 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F021G3002 500lb GP Bomb (40mm ACK right next to radars)

RESULT = nothing went down.

CROSS VALLEY and attack single 88 mm on north hilltop.....

3rd 500lb GP bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:02:54 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F021G0001 500lb GP Bomb (88mm ACK northern hilltop)

RESULT = nothing went down.

4th 500lb GP bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:02:54 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F021G0001 500lb GP Bomb (88mm ACK northern hilltop)

RESULT = nothing went down.

88mm still up! turned around and strafed it down finally
Sun Nov 24 22:03:04 2013 DESTROYED +bolok MosquitoVI F021G0001 STRAFE

Went back to strafe dish radar but was dismayed to see the 40mm still there plugging away.
Went to land

Sun Nov 24 22:14:43 2013 LAND +bolok MosquitoVI C1 F32

RESULT OF 1ST SORTIE = 1 X 88M DESTROYED AFTER 2 X 500LBS ON IT + A LONG STRAFE TO FINISH IT

==========================================
Second sortie on F141

Sun Nov 24 22:15:39 2013 LAUNCH +bolok MosquitoVI ORD7 C1 F32
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141WM003 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141TW001 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141WM003 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141TW001 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141WM003 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141AD002 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141TW001 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141WM003 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:19:37 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141AD002 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:20:01 2013 HIT +bolok MosquitoVI F141TW001 500lb GP Bomb
Sun Nov 24 22:21:01 2013 DESTROYED +bolok MosquitoVI F141AD002 STRAFE
Sun Nov 24 22:21:01 2013 DESTROYED +bolok MosquitoVI F141AD003 STRAFE


Again hits but nothing went down to bombs, had to resort to strafing a couple AMMO DUMPS.

Wow. How to conduct a successfull operation with you dont have accurate charts for destruct power or targets damage limits.

My experience with 88's so far all testing has been they go down with one bomb. I started with the 100kg and have worked up from there. They do seem hard to strafe down with one run but killable in two strafing passes with LA5. After all they only have a ( 400 defence point strength)

The Massive fire power of Mossie VI should easily take them down, and two 500's should be massive over kill. This indicates to me that the specific 88 is defectivly modled for some reason. Perhaps you should ID the gun and give it to JABO for a look see.

On the DAR em ( 1250 defence points ) A 2000 lber GP has ( 3750 attack points ) should easily take it down. This confirms my belief that this bomb also has been neutered as well. Two 1000's are (1875 attack points X 2) or and identical 3750 attack points same as a 2000 lber.

Maybe were losing this thing not to fighter or bomber tactics. Maybe like in the Faulklands war and the Argentines , we are loosing this due to defective ordinance data and defective ordinance. I.E. defective WB target/destruct programming.

I suppose over time some have reset things to meet there personnal adgenda and it never got changed back. Reading the charts the defence/strength settings seem well though out and accuratly mirror reality. Someone did alot of educated thought. Then it got changed without control. I wonder if we have someone with the time and ability to reset the settings back to the charts.

I don't know if this will help on targeting but here are some of the (Damage required to distruct) figures I have found, But with bombs obviously not at strength settings they should be I don't know if their useful. I'm trying to find a way in this Pea brain of mine of devising a chart to decifer and calculate actual damage/ defence settings on these things so we have a realistic chance of, "this bomb will destroy that." The only bomb im secure in feeling its attack points are ok is the 100kg bomb. So far I believe the 500 lber is modeled at a -40% factor or instead of 1173 attack points its 700 attack points(rounded).

Figures below are based on the 100kg bomb used. Believe these targets have been given steroids at some point and for our purposes their defence points should be.

HG Hanger ...(2500) took 5865 attack points to destroy
RD Radar EM (1800) took 6192 to 8311 attack points to destroy. (twice I got it with 6192 points so the other figure may be a field anomaly.)
AD Ammo ....(1500)took 4692 attack points to destroy.
FD fuel ........(400)..took 2564 attack points to destroy.

Side note ET Barracks (3000) When I attacked it it took aprox (1500 attack points ) to kill . So it looks like this one got readjusted as well in our favor.

The "OBJECT HARDNESS" and "WEAPONS" file are unique to the S3 arena.

No point trying to test offline.
Jabo can confirm easily enough if the correct files are loaded to the General.
Eg: values for 500GP bomb and obj hardness for acks

hehe... sometimes to swat a fly you have to flay around alot till you find out what his patterns are and what room he resides in.

So let me get this straight. Haven't yet but ..

If I go into the S3 arena.... and log in... then x out and go directly to free flight... and bring up the arena thats operational at this time...

1) Colors of bases are now in the free flight arena. >>> this is true.. I can verify this.

2) The S3 arena "settings" are also in this "free flight" arena as well.... YES...or ... NO? As related to bomb attack or target defence.

I've heard it both ways now. I've also been unable to do something in Free Arena after having done this and found the same failure in there. Haven't done enough to be comfortable believing settings similar yet though.
Problem for me with S3 is time involved.. time distance between targets. As Jabo told me he can sit right over a target and continue to drop bombs on it. I have to fly from nearest air base with limited plane ordinace ability. course given a 5 hour reset time on everything I can do it if my wife doesnt divorce me first for giving this sim more time than her. Also don't want to undulely dump on Jabo as he has a life also. But if what it takes to be accurate is take the time, guess ill try If not just to improve S3 but lessen the frustration levels of those who spend hours planning and practicing only to find frustration as the target sites there unrealisticly and laughs at them. I.E. a truck taking 20 100kg bombs to destroy.

But I guess question two is the biggee.. responce apreciated.

I watched the LW strafe down the DAR EM and DAR shack in a couple of passes. It took 34 37mm rounds to destroy a DAR EM object in off line practice. I logged into the S3 arena first then to offline.

These carrier objects take over 70 37mm rounds to destroy. The other vehicles pop with one round.

This is finaly entry on this post:

Conclusions:
The use of off line to test any bomb attack power , or target defence points for S3 is of no use. The two have no connection at all.

If you go into the S3 then get out and go to free flight you do get a look of what base is on who's side. This could be useful for looking at targets on bases or for distance navigation between bases or to view terrain and practice approaches or such. That is all.

This morning I tested 2000 lbers against various targets for strength of bomb and it passed this test.
In the S3 arena I hit (E1 ReFinBuild1) on field 16 at 8,5 1 (defence points 3600) . This is the largest target to which 2000 lb ( 3750 attack points.) bomb should be able to take down. "It did".

The only target the 2000 lber didn't take down on the list was an RS Radar station at field 182. I tryed twice to take this down and it wouldnt go. However this Radar station has a Revetment around three sides. I surmised that maybe this structure was upping the defence model for the station. I then went to field 184 to attack the RD Radar EM. The RS there is located in proximity to this EM and has no protective Revetment. When the bomb exploded " BOTH" targets went down the RD Radar EM (which was the target) and the RS Radar station. Which is to conclude the RS in fact will go down under the weight of a 2000 lber. And the 2000 lber is correctly modeled "in S3 arena. "

Just as a (make sure) I went off line to free flight, and dropped on a lighter target hanger which would not go down yesterday But did this morning in S3 arena. Again in the off line the 2000 lber couldn't take it down.
P.S. This morning S3.. the 2000 lber took down a carrier(truck) and also one a distance away so I feel the issue of trucks has been solved.

Thanks all who gave me input and assistance at this. I will publish my findings on 2000 lber on a new thread.