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AAR CO frame I
http://squadselectseries.com/s3forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1744		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Sasquatch [ Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:24 am ]
Post subject:  AAR CO frame I
Well, the best laid plans.....

My initial plan was to eliminate the dar stations on the south coast of Shikoku so follow on frames have a better chance of getting closer to the Japanese Islands before being detected. The priority were the stations at 174 and 134. These open up a significantly large gap that can be exploited. By using the Naval OPS area, we have completed 1 of 2 frames that have to be done in this area. I knew the CVs in the west (TF1) would be exposed at the beginning of the frame but by basing the 4th and the 23rd on the eastern CV group, I thought it would give the enemy pause as a strike COULD be coming from that area. Unfortunately, the enemy shuffled around his assets enough that the TBF strike I wanted to hit the DAR at 173 was detected and nullified before I could get fighters in the area to assist. Later in the frame I tried to get the 23rd into 174 with ord to finish it but they were busted just before they popped dar and had to abort. Fortunately, they had enough of a lead to get back to friends and only 1 was lost.
I can't say enough about how well the fighter groups did this evening. You guys were extremely flexible and extremely deadly every time you met the enemy. The initial enemy strike DID take down one of our CV's but were wiped out to the man. Later, you all wiped out the Kamikaze strike in a like manner. Kudo's to you all!

And last, but defintely not least, I want to thank the Nomads/UMM for their uncanny ability to sneak in undetected on BOTH dars I prioritized and take them BOTH down. A hearty <S> and well done!

I think with all the restrictions that were placed on us combined with all the double-shuffling that I was doing with the groups really had the enemy baffled as to our intentions and hopefully you all had a great time as well :D

Again, a big <S> to you all....you rock :mrgreen:
Author:  Gums [ Mon Jan 11, 2016 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Salute!

Acthally, Bigfoot, I only damaged one dar at 174 and maybe killed another at 134. Gundoc finished them off after I pranged on the boat ( ramp strike cause too slow at end). Gofly may have hit 174 after Gums, but will have to ask/check the S6 log.

There were two EM's at each site and we had only got that right after the first run.

NS were AWOL, so we may have to regroup for the three or four UMM/Nomad step. Nofly showed, but then discoed or left.

Sorry I pranged as could have lurched agin to help.

Gums sends...
Author:  Darryl [ Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Sasquatch wrote:
the TBF strike I wanted to hit the DAR at 173 was detected and nullified before I could get fighters in the area to assist.


Big Hairy One, the Doolittle's Raiders fought our way into F173 from about 10 miles out and after losing all but about three of us on ingress, we took down both the radars, as per your orders. While trying to get away, the rest of us were taken down.

When did we lose the cover and why? We don't need to repeat that over the next frames.

Frame CO seat can drive ya nuts. Tough job, but someone has to do it, right? Haha.

Thanks for the fun night, sir! <S>
Author:  Sasquatch [ Mon Jan 11, 2016 8:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Darryl wrote:
Sasquatch wrote:
the TBF strike I wanted to hit the DAR at 173 was detected and nullified before I could get fighters in the area to assist.


When did we lose the cover and why? We don't need to repeat that over the next frames.



Thanks for the fun night, sir! <S>


Darryl, the 352 and 23rd were playing cat n mouse in @ a 60 mile grid south of Shikoku with the enemy fighters (and the N1K is good!). That's why I had you move you ingress around in the hopes of sneaking you in undetected. When the 23rd had some in pursuit to the east and the rest were moving west to where the 352nd was, I thought this was your best opportunity to get in (split them and go up the middle).Unfortunately, they were fully engaged when they found you and the 4th was too far away to assist. I'm sorry that you were unable to egress after dropping on the dar but I didn't have any assets to help (although the 4th made an attempt to get there).
Hopefully it helps that the IJN strike was obliterated after knocking off a CV and the kamikaze stike was DIP (Die In Place). :mrgreen:

The good news is only one more frame in the Naval Ops area.....you can heavy bomber them to death for 3 frames! 8-)
Author:  =vslp= [ Tue Jan 12, 2016 12:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Seeing as how good laid plans go away after first contact, I think we adapted well to a very fluid situation......Nice work in staying with it big hairy one. The very large area we had to fly in made it difficult to react fast...to anything
Author:  Darryl [ Tue Jan 12, 2016 2:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Sasquatch wrote:
The good news is only one more frame in the Naval Ops area.....you can heavy bomber them to death for 3 frames! 8-)


Thanks for the details, Hairy One.

Looking back, I can't help but remember many frames over the last seven years in the S3 where fighter cover is removed from bombers with disastrous effects. I've been in a B25, Ju88, and even a B24 without fighter protection. It's not a pretty sight when the smoke clears. We, tend to move the fighters where the action is and forget the action is coming to the bombers, eventually. We are not called con magnets for no reason.

By way of evaluation and not Monday morning quarterbacking, would it have been different if we had simply dedicated fighter protection and allowed them to protect the bomber group both in and out of the target area? Going into the second frame, I would like to know that we can give that idea a try. We have the best fighter squads together for this series: 4th FG, 23rd, and 352nd. I believe that the enemy would have tried, but failed miserably at attacking the bomber group.

Don't misread my post. I know how it goes while sitting in the big chair. I've done it a few times, myself. It's tough. I am only suggesting that we go back to basics. We decide on an RP and we all meet for the run into the target. Let us know what you want us to do for the next frame. We will do our best to get it done.

Sincerely,
Darryl <S>
CO of Doolittle's Raiders

P.S. FYI, the bomber run to F173 was not nullified. We took down the dars there, sir.
Author:  Sasquatch [ Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Darryl wrote:

Sincerely,
Darryl <S>
CO of Doolittle's Raiders

P.S. FYI, the bomber run to F173 was not nullified. We took down the dars there, sir.


Sorry, what I meant by nullified is that 'i know you were capable of doing more damage had they not found you" :D

Great news 173 is down (must have missed that in the buffer)! That means that 3/4 of the dars on the south end of the island are gone...the US Navy aviators will be very happy indeed :mrgreen:
Author:  Gums [ Wed Jan 13, 2016 1:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Salute!

Added to DR observations, and they ain't whining.

It is true we can waste lites doing close 'scort and no enema shows up. Likewise, we can have cosmic sweep, CAP and other tactics for the lites while the enema attacks the buffs with 20 or 30 interceptors.

So the CO must evaluate the threat and allocate our resources wisely. And this aspect of the big chair is most challenging, ya think?

Nomads lucked out becasue the enema lites were focused upon DR and escorting the CV attacks. So we had virtually no oppo uintil our second run.

Only way I can see a huge lite close escort is if the main buff strike is well away from other strikes by the smaller units AND other lites are conducting sweep and CV CAP. We just have to have some kinda plan that can get friendly lites to get to the buffers in time to help, especially upon egress with a few of us smoking.

Gums opines...
Author:  Robert [ Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Some constructive criticism, so don't turn it into a flame war please.

For future frames, we must ensure our bombers/strikers don't run in to target without escort. Far better would be for the buffs to circle around waiting for fighters to get in place. The fighters will often get tangled up against enemy opposition like in last frame, so the buffs need to be flexible about their ingress timing. We should always have dedicated protection assigned of course, but as plans have a tendency to change on the fly depending on enemy action (engaging our escorts, launching kamikaze attacks etc), the Buff groups simply need to have a "HOLD" button enabled.

Now, I think the Frame CO has enough on his plate during an event, so I would suggest it should be the responsibility of the buff group to ask if there is escort ensured before they go in. If there isn't, then simply circle around or keep away from the fight until there is. We fighters want to give you the best protection we can, but sometimes you have to give us the time to deal with unexpected events first. :-)

Otherwise thanks all for a thrilling frame, was fun for sure.

Cheers!
/Robert
Author:  Gums [ Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AAR CO frame I
Salute!

I see no criticism, Robert. You are simply stating what many of us here have known and seen for years.

A few years back, Whawk, Hawk and Gums would plan frames that had the buffs climbing and then entering a racetrack. When initial sweeps and such were completed, the buffs would set sail and the returning sweeps could then re-arm and fuel and be reception escort.

The dedicated buff escort could delay a bit to save fuel while we whales climbed.

Gums sends...
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